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The 1-2 Podcast
The 1-2 Podcast

Episode 47 · 4 months ago

Episode #47 Richie Wellens Talks Tangerine

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

Host Tom Johnson spoke to former player and captain for Blackpool F.C. Richie Wellens. Tom discussed issues surrounding Wellens departure, comments he siad, his thoughts on facing them again including the infamous Charlie Adam tackle. Tom also touches on Wellens time as a manager and working with now Blackpool talents Jerry Yates and Keshi Anderson. 

Welcome to the one to podcast by you TMP. We had great Camerad I think the fan player relationships incredible. It's the best changer in by mile that I've been in theven kind of things made the team stronger, made the bond stronger, made kind of playing to the club that kind of strange a little bit more enjoyable. A small, unbelievabtality group who was just absolutely think I could tangently unstoppable force. What come back to the second season of YOU TMP pods. Just let you know we still have plenty of prints and mugs available. Telebos improve our content further and keep us running. Thanks you continue support. So far, an episode forty seven of the UTMP podcasts. We would drained by today's special guest, Rissie Ellen's Richie made a hundred ninety one appearances for the pool, scoring sixteen goals. Richie spoke about relegation, promotion and LVD Van's trophy win and moving on from Blackpool. Rig You all right, I get on our the Benis been busy this week and keep yourself active. Or Yeah, I'm going to hold his feet, going hold his field reach stoke later on. Five. I've got it. A little bit earlier. So I go to that game. Just trying to get out to games and just get yourself out there and get out the house for other than that, yeah, not so much. I'm out to enjoying the break. Yeah, yeah, it must been a while since you've had a break, isn't it? You've had most preseasons are involved either player or managing. It's must be nice if better time off, like I say, but hopefully back into row sooner than later as well. Well, I just need to choose a right one. Not Look Yeah, twenty five years straight. The only three months that I've had away from being a job is when I left salfered and that was three months from the lockdown. So obviously couldn't do anything. So I've enjoyed the last couple of months. Probably made a mistake going in it last club because of the financial restrictions there. was was extreme, to be honest. Put Yeah, I need to get the next one right. HMM. Yeah, it took there on the time at doncaster to think the fact that you played from maybe you know in Flut your decision. Would you what? Are you gone there otherwise? Is Sort of the question. Or you know we are unaware of the full sort of situation you lay yourself in for. They're now one hunderd percent. A might probably let my heart rull my head when I went and actually was about to get the job. He was a big, big elephant in the room, which was obviously the available budget to me, and when I heard what the available budget was it put a massive doubt in my mind because I knew it was going to be a big struggle. But you know, I got sold in on the for five year project. We knew it was going to be aneath. Everybody was fit, would probably would have finished fifteen sixteen. That would have been a decencies influence. Yeah, but the with the amount of injuries that we had as well, for eight to two fifteen any given time and a game, it just proved...

...an impossible job. So now Weishu club all the best. It's still a club that is close to my heart, but he's probably just a wrong time for me. Yeah, makes sense. Oh, I will take it back to back to your start of your playing career, if that's all right. So just touching a little bit on money united. When you came through. Obviously I think you're you're fan of the club as well play with some top players at that stage, and then just how the move to Blackpool came about as well. If I was sot of you looking for the first team football, and also how the actual move, the contact from Blackpool and and how that all went through. That's all right and well. I was obviously at united a Longlong time, probably one of the best midfields you've ever had. Something's real. He's going to be really tough to break into. I got an idea that I wasn't going to be get me opportunity. They I said I I year left on my contract and actually went to on trial to bonds and bonds with a championship and how he bast was a manager. He wanted to sign me, but he pulled me into this for me. Want to sign your but you're only going to go in our researves because the team's currently fifty in a championship. We're going to try and get promote to the premier league and we don't really want to change in midfield. I think Jeff Thomas was in midfield at the time. Pretty kidnet know some really good players. So I didn't want to go from Man United Reserves to two barns in the reserves. To be honest, I wait to play men's football. So I actually remembered coming home from Barnes that the train station and knowing that I wasn't going to get anything, that actually trying at the train station because my career is at a cross roads where I need to just play and and obviously if a club like barns are willing to take your fee for the first team. It was a difficult situation to being but I think the reason that Steven man sign if the black pool was he didn't have many options on. My agent punted me into him and I think he just took took me off the off chance if. And be honest, yeah, so was that? You mentioned Barnes in the championship, but Paul was struggling in league one at that time. was that kind of did you feel like you were better than that level and you were sort of all we're getting a little bit you know anything, I'll do it this point. Can I what was your sort of head space that time? Now, I mean I thought aways better in the level, but you need to approve it all. I all I was was, you know, you look at the young lads now they think you think the premier league plays for playing for these Premier League twenty three is that they're not done. The twenty three is players and I kind of at the realization I was just a reserve player run chester united. I wasn't a first team player. So I needed to be. I need to just get out and work and try to be very better, try and carve a career out myself, because I'd seen plays state united too long and when he did leave united they just struggled to it that they didn't really couldn't get the head round it. Obviously, whenever, every time we play for my united is whether on the all we didn't really need to fight because we just better, better opposition than the new ever we play against. So I know I needed to get out.

So I maybe debut stoke away at nineteen, going from possession football to all of a sudden playing stoke away my first game was it was a massive I open. Yeah, interesting in you've got some knowing the manure that academy even years nineteen. So he'll get really against that point where you where you mentioned there in terms of barns, or whether he's where Theo's pathways at united or whether it looks to go out on loan or permanently elsewhere as well. You must be able to give him some advice and it does a Leon. You Are you trying to stay out of it? Now? I try to stay out if he's got an age and when he's dad speaks from even a probably been through everything that he's going to encounter when his career. He goes in one ear and out the other. So I'd try and I try and keep it distance and what I'd rather do is he comes to me for advice and rather than me keeping down his ear all the time. But we're just in AP process of trying to get him a long move. He's got two or three days left at a wind that a potentially a couple of things might happen. But if not, then when we get to the summer he is getting to the stays now where and needs to took out on loan and change from a boy to a man. Yeah, and then Black Pool, and so you've gone in. Unfortunately, the end of the season, lets was getting relegated to you now in, you know, the fourth division, but you're set. You were straight in when you first team football, running the midfield sort of found your feet really quickly at that level and then helps us win promotion that season. So what was that like? The must have been nice to feel that you were you know you capable of that level and beyond. And also, what impact is Steve Mmr I've on you, given it was such a great man field of himself and if playing career well, I think it was probably my fault that he was got relegated. becauld use you in a posit and and I got sent off away older, which was a it was a ridiculous tackle. So I felt that I'd let the team down and let Steve Down. On my contract was only till the end of the season, so I did have an option to leave, but I just thought it was right to stay and try and I did feel no responsible for that for that day away Oldham's what Steve was great. Steve was great. Your meal seems hard, but I also thought it was fair and I probably played for two managers in my career, Steve McMahon and John Sheridan. The if the actually work with better players, they could have caved that really good manager, manager or career just at sometimes being the players and how good they were. They got frustrated at time that the players couldn't do the same, same as what they could as plays. But now Steve was great for me. Good, good, good guy, like I say, really really hard, but very fair as well. Yeah, so what were highlights in Sangine? Would you say that? You know that the halfway iron goal against port vel comes to mind. He scored a goal in the semi final against us. Feel for the LDV one promotion, a couple of LDV wins as well. So must have been. You must have felt it was a successful time for you. Unfortunately, ever made that step to the championship, which you know you later did in your later career. So how do you reflect on the time as a whole? Well, I think as I get a lot of stick from Blackpool fans because you know, I could see the potential look club, but no one wanted to push it forward. The chair and didn't want to put money in, you know, and you're look at it now, the...

...fan base, a support and the chair you've got now that's what I wanted all of years ago. I didn't want to drift and and stay in the middle of League one. I felt we signed players that were not good enough to get us where we wanted to be and it come to a point where I was getting close Bristol city, coming from a Crystal Palace when when he and Dowey was was manager and took him on a fantastic run to the premier league, when he was bottom of the championship, and I was just getting frustrated and never let that frustration go on a picture. Always tried my very, very best, but you know, year on year I was included in the team of the year for the PFA team of every single year, more or less, and I wanted my career to progressor wanted it to be with Black Pool Estate that the club for five years, but just didn't feel that the Steve was giving the back in to try and makers or try and change from a mid table team year on year out to the team that could get in a playoffs and and eventually go up. Yeah, makes sense. Going back to it. Yeah, going back for I'm really fond of me time there. Supporters were fantastic with me, but every time that I played, obviously got a little bit and I always turned sour at the end when, and I take that as a compliment, the fact that they didn't want me to leave and we felt that he was good tip, that dad didn't want to leave, but it got to the stage where I just couldn't seem my career was probably stagnating a plast. Stayed there for probably a year, two long, which is was disappointing because I didn't want it to end on a Saut so I know what you have the fans with fans are great. You me and I'll still go back to a stadium now. went to I went to the Middlesbury game two or three weeks ago and after say what they've done with a stadium now and the atmosphere that ground is brilliant. My my fa year old lad who absolutely loves it there, loves the atmosphere and he's always mourning for me to go back and I'm back for the Bristol City game as well. billion. Well, you manage that in you a couple of years ago, but it was a behind closed doors. Who when I got that? You'll have seen the stadium, of course, all you out a little done a few times since she left. Thought to see the Noll Sam rocking and what the you know, this season, since since I has had took over, it is on another level. So when you say you didn't want to be in mid table and the one at the time it did hurt when you left for all them, but I think looking back, we're all grown ups now, aren't we? It's you can understand. There's a lot. You know, it's a different club now and you can totally feel that what you wanted is exactly what's happened, which is great now, but at the time it just wasn't happening INMA. You know, I felt when I left the club and any start signing players like David Vaughan. Where's Hulahan, Charlie Adam, and he started playing. I'm thinking I've been there for four years awaiting V to sign players like that and I leave and then they actually be older in the playoffs and get promoted today to the champion which this on my head was was all over the place then because I didn't want to leave. Yeah, it's just you know, when I'm obviously I'm engracion took over and I had one game under Simon Grays. Have to say, is a really good guy and a good manager as well. Yeah, what just talking about? When you were leaving then you said there was a bit of interest in contract was running down. So we what did you decide? Pretty early on...

...in that season, this wasn't work. You know, the club started to go on down with trajectory. We had Colin dry was in, like he said, Simon Grayson, that that bit of a spell. The club was on a bit of a downward trajectory. Did you just decide right, whatever off comes in, I'm all for what was the sort of again back so I think, at the time. So what it was is when I left, when I left united because they let me go for free, they wanted a fifty percent sell on. Yeah, so with that fifty percent seal and I also, I think, had fifteen percent in my contract of any future transfer for so if the club was to sell met, the club would only actually get thirty five percent, which you can imagine, Car Lyston was not too happy about that. So every club that came in it was a no. It was a no. And then Colin Enry came in and Colin Way to play a different style of football, which which I wasn't very good at, and I totally get what he wanted to do. Is he was a manager. was a prerogative to play the way that he wanted. I didn't really fit into that. So the reason that I actually came to Oldham is because my first son was just born. So I wanted to get back to Manchester. and Scott Vernon came along to to black pool and done really well, and Colin Dry Lights, and so they ended up doing a swap deal to to get around the sixty five percent which would have obviously not gone to the club's pocket. Yeah, makes sense. I know Scott Vernon came, but it feels like oist and almost accepted nothing rather than the thirty five percent and the pain of that happening. So Classic Oist, and end up with with a worst deal than it probably would have got if it is sold you for you know what you're probably worth at the time. But it's happened with hunders of players, isn't it? Without that chairman, so I don't I don't blame yourself. Fair play in terms of the move to all them. I can't remember the exact quote but I'm sure you are along. You said something along the lines of you felt like it was a chance to do it was a club with more ambition or you know, the more likely to get to the championship and I think that's where it started to go south with Black Paul, given you probably left out a contract the I think the bad blood started at that point in the what do you recall that time and dear sort of yeah, I mean, I's not like my memory is not the greatest, but you got to understand my point of view. When I leave a club to go to another club, I'm not going to go to Oldham and turn around and go well, I just left the bigger club and I've only really come here because I didn't feel that they was matching my ambition. So funds an understand that when you when you join a new club, you have to give their support. Is the biggest belief that you're going to do. You've come for the right reasons and you want to take that Pul forward. It was nothing against Black Poo. Will you you just do the fact that at that time Oldham we're actually splashing a bit of money around and signing players. I Remember League Becketts sign and the Little Palm Wall Paul Paul Warn Shan Green. You can so he did that have up to eat a decent team. What I didn't know, like I said, is that when I left. They're going to sound like likes of Wazoul and he's obviously fantastic plays for league one. Yeah, you would have. You would have been great, I'm sure, in the Blackpool side. But you've took some what happened in the playoffs and then you moved to doncaster after that and eventually did get that...

...promotion. It mustn't tasted all the sweet to knowing. You know that that pain that you've been through so many times of nearly getting there and then finally getting promoted at Wembley with with Donnie as well. How did was that like? The speaking career so far at that point? So well. And so we're at when Ley in front of Eightyzero against leads and he's a Yorkshire Derby and planning against a massive club. That was obviously the highlight up to lent but it was just at that found someone in Sewan or driscoll. But all of a sudden I wasn't playing off the cuff every week. So it wasn't like, you know, for a lot of years at Blackpool we we we just got on the pitch and go, you know what, one play, gone, play, go and enjoy it. Gone Express Yourself, which is great when it's going really well, but then when you find teams at that cause you problems, are more than a match to you, while sometimes even better players in you, then you need structures to work from and I never really had that. When I found Shawn or Driscol then I only said believed every time I went on the pitch I was going a bit of best player on the pitch, whether it be even if my passing was off or wherever, and I had basics to basics to work from, and he totally chip. He totally turned my career around. The accelerated very quickly and you know, within one year of playing Donnie had moved from from being a decently one player to all of a sudden being one of the best players in the championship. Yeah, you move to lesser than as well. Then we got a quite a big move. Their million quids and that's when our crop, our past again with the black will get you know, we were in the championship and that's when you you know, it was the darning one. There was also lesser as well. I recall you took a quick free kicking. You don't remember that, and I think my if I had scored against us. Yeah, against I do remember that. Your yeah, that was a cheeky one. And there's a couple. Obviously the Charlie Adam incident at Bloomfield road as well, when you came back just before that with with doncastle. What would you remember? That hostile. I was like what remember that? So I get tackled, I think I I think I kicked off in for a frowing and as off kit as I've slid and a fall down. Charlie Adams stamps on the stomach and I get the blame for it. So it was he was a bit of a fun Batti year at the time. So obviously I'm trying to make the most of it because I want child Adams to get the sent off because of what my teams wd have the advantage. Yeah, but the's some other blackfield supports play. Blame me. When it was Charlie Adam, the stamps on it on his on my chest and to be fair, actually help Chap Charlie because he had to became a bit of a cult here then and after the game I come out with the ground that he's probably fifteen lads waiting for me to try and to try and get old of me and have a bit of a Rookus with me. So all see, it was all a bet fun by enjoy going back because he made it a little bit of a do. He was not. We always got taste and I'll never forget Simon Grayson having a pre match interview with someone and he said we can't make it about him, I've got a concentrate on myself ca that enjoyed it. You know, if I would have turned up and none would have spoken, just let me drift away, then then I'll probably wouldn't have played as well, but I always that's that's what trying to got me going as...

...a player that know the band of between supports and especially if you ask any players that played with me or against with you probably sales a nightmare to play with, because that's what that's what just got the best start of me. All abandon and demands that are put on on my on my teammates, because I knew that if I wasn't doing it myself, then I couldn't set them. The MONDS and others. Yeah, I remember the just really an a little bit to that when you're older. I think you scored a goal and he celebrated fromt of the Blackpool fans as well. The I'm sure the lines been had his flag up and he was going to give up side and here celebrating right next to the linesman. But then the gold got given and remember that one laugh. I do remember that. Yeah, yeah, I just I can't remember what I got. I can't remember the goal. Remember the celebration because did look like he was going to disallowed it. But yeah, I just ran over and said, don't you they're keeps put it down, so are yeah, I can't remember. I remember the goal to be only. I just remember that celebration. But am there's some when you're a playoff and you get that much stick and it's constant stick every time you touch the ball. If you give them, if you give the ball away really, then then sometimes it's nice to get your own back as well. Yeah, it was funny how much you passed across from blackpoolkers. We didn't go up a little bit sooner, but then you came in and you in, you know, like I just touched on doncaster and Lester. It was like in that ten year period you played for us and five and then you played against as probably four or five out of the six or something like that. Yeah, was that? Was it fixed? You look for you think you were. We glad to be in the same league or would you prefer not? It sounds like you love playing and I was game, so you probably we're looking forward to it. Yeah, honestly, I loved that. I knew for a fact was going to turn up. I knew I was going to get abuse. I knew pretty kind of the only time I didn't enjoy actually went back with shrews breath and I was about I was probably about thirty seven and my legs had gone. I was obviously nowhere near the play that that hope that I was and I was on a massive downward spiral and terms of my mobility and an injuries and actually walked. I actually got substitute because I was injured and as a watch off there was a supporter's little a golf golf willing's pretending you're injured, and it wasn't pretending I was injured. I was just thirty seven. I couldn't run non warm me. Body was backing up for that made me chuckle and it was that. I didn't enjoy that because I knew that the ability to get the supported back in him. Yeah, and I was in two thousand and sixteen and seen as well, which the time when there a lot of fans of boycotting the club. So you must know sly I say probably wasn't quite the same as the previous times you've been back. Is Liken. You hear my dog? Yeah, he's about that big, so I'm surprised his bark is so loud, but I think someone's just walking. Hey. Well, sorry about that now, don't worryeah. I mean I obviously got the discontent with a club and I totally get it. For All that this content from from for the club. I was seeing that for five, six years earlier. HMM, yeah, exactly. So...

...we've touched on probably all of the points yard and the good times at black polled, the you know, the games against us as well. The one I've not mentioned really, is it? SAMMI I go. I don't know if you ember that. That was a big to do at the time. Obviously we running side at that point as well. You remember that sort of battle with him? Yeah, I mean she res an experience play. He's not the ball passinger and, as I've tried to turn and run exide, if not put my arm against him. And he's dived and he's got sent off and he was pretty clever said to me as soon he got so an off, he said, I've dived there. So I know the referee boy. I mean it's Mighty's unfortunate for me, but you know, it's probably a good experience play from him and he got his side V ten advantage. So I've got don't hold anything against him. Yeah, of course, just a storm in a teacup probably at the time. But that's it. Such, only management then. So was that something you always wants to go into? You see yourself becoming a manager, or was it something thought about towards them? Now, I tried on me. I'd done my acla when I was about thirty three. At leicster are still had I might be thirty three D and thirty three. I saw that two years left on my contract. But when I come back that that hit me. You know, I'd not had I had had a couple of injuries, little injuries, throughout my career, but that was one of them injuries where any given moment you can create and just be taken away from you. So whereas when I was a young player. I was coming out to black pool. I was quite as I like to drink. I went into a dressing room at at Black Pool, which was average age must have been twenty two. We had John eils and Tommy Ashen Phil Bands. We probably had six or seven lads at like to drink and he's probably the worst thing for me. It's going in a dressing room at the time because I like to drink and I was trying to get my head on and and just concentrate on my football. So I made a conscious effort when I was two and thirty three to make sure right, okay, I need to plan properly. Now what do I need to do? So started doing my coaching badges, started watching the way that Nigel Person Works and taking notes. Didn't want to be a manager, I wasn't sure at that time, but I definitely wanted to stay in football. I Am I love the coaching side of football. So that was probably the moment where where it hit me that you know, I need I need to start making sure that and prepared if I'm and of them are going to get a coaching or manager jobs. So I'm ready to go. And you said they're about this, arguably them as they as you made, and I think it was in the soul a documentary recently way you'd mentioned that you'd made some mistakes as a young player and I wanted to make sure that, taking it into management, you wanted to make sure your players didn't make those, say, mistakes. It took someone now, in terms of the drinking culture that you became a part of. Potentially anything else come to mine in terms of whether you don't in the united with friend you could have played at higher level or what those mistakes are you sort of talking about that you wish, you know you don't differently. So from the ages of sixteen, two nineteen, I've been given...

...everything. I've been given a good deal. At my united I was in England under sixteen, Seventeen, eighteen, nineteens and everything was running smooth. But I was in the same age you was Joel Cole, Steven Gerrardscot Parker, Michael Owen, Ledley King, Wes Brown, Jonathan Woodgate, and they had it all gone and and made the first seam debuts and it didn't quite happen for me. And it didn't happen for me because I didn't live me. I didn't live my life right at the time I did didn't practice what my weaknesses were, which woman ability, my physical presence. I felt like at the technical ability that it was as good as anyone that I've that was playing with her that time. But I didn't. I didn't use my get my puzzique right. My mom ability was a problem. I was sharp over ten yards, but when it got to fifteen, twenty, then people with catch me up. I didn't. I didn't work on that and so when I when I went into management, I wanted to try and it Pres Seas I had no nomal to help me at that time when I was a young a young player. When you've got one manager, he's got it. He's got twenty players to look after, so he's not just going to concentrate on one. I purposely try and go out my way to make sure what does every single player that work we need and make sure I give them all the the right information and giving me an the right tools go and carry it out. And then, obviously, as a manager, I don't I work as ot as anybody's impossible when I when I'm in a job, to work as ours that kind amount of games. I'm looking opposition, I'm looking at players. So I've tried to make sure that I didn't go back to when I was sixteen, to twenty two, twenty three and try and give me best myself, the best chance. Yeah, makes sense. So how do you reflect that on your playing career? Overall athletes in a play for twenty one years. I enjoyed it. I won, I want at Wehmbley as a player won three times at the Millennium Stage. You've played with a big club in it Leicster, in its which Black Pool Don casters from good clubs could have done better. Absolutely so, with a little bit of tinge of regret because I could have a lot better. I've done well out the game, but I could have done a lot better as well. Is that was Thursi on then that feeling that you maybe should have achieve more. Is that what makes you give you a drive for manager or one of the factors that done that? It's totally different because as a player you can you can control everything you've got in the pitch and you can impact it. When you're a manager it's so many different facets. Have you got the finances? As I you've got the right players? What situation you going into? What is a structure of the club, from the top to the bottom? He's so many different aspects of a football club and, to be honest, mate, is not a lot of football clubs that are really run right nowadays. Anybody that goes into black pool now, with the current situation, will manage well. Anybody that goes into Brentford, anybody don't goes into M K don's bright and got every opportunity to be really successful because of the clubs are doing it the right way. There is probably a dozen, twenty clubs in the country that doing...

...it the right way, but the old also a lot of clubs that that need ripping up and starting again, and that's such on your management. Then one that comes to mine is the time it's when the Ma Jerry Eights, who obviously is at Blackpool now. What was he allowed to work with? What's he could you see? I I mean he was, to says, potential, quicker the most people because you had spoke so highly of him, and he's doing it in the championship. Now. He's not quite in the team every week, but you know, the fans love him and it how hard he works and he's clearly got the ability as well. Yeah, not the best, the best, the best ladder you can ever meet. Driven hungry. Whatever you ask him to do, he will do a fantastic lad and I obviously you've got cashier's got a huge amount of buility. When the first took all that swindon me and cash you just clashed a little bit because he's how he was playing his head to how he's playing on a Saturday and tues it was like night and day. But I knew that you had the ability to att a treat Kesh you a little bit different to the rest of the players, which in the end worked. But I have to say that that keshy Anderson, fantastic player, with Jerry eight as a ladd is one of the best of ever met. Actually actually went to a meeting with we've been Mansford in living before critch got the job and I was interested in taking it. I think David done was the care taker at the time. I nearly got it before. When? When? When? When Garry Bowler left, but the the care taker done really well, so I just missed out on it. Then that was we we've own oyster. But then I met their Mansford and I just couldn't leave swindon because I knew I was going to win the League of him. I turn the club around. He's a brilliant football club and everything been managerd was saying to my nudis black peeld is going to take off, it's going to take off, but the chairman at Swindon was so good to me I just couldn't do it. So my I couldn't leave. And then colvid happened ten days or two weeks after. So that was a that was a huge problem. And actually on my list of players are presented to to to Ben Mansford was keshy Anderson and Jerry Eighteen. So I remember then, you knits, I remember so and the others. Yeah, fair play to him because he's him the two to two great lads. Yeah, cause she's one of them. I'm sure I'm probably telling stuff you already know, but cash you season he had. It was unfortunate with injuries, but he had a really good preseason and he looked good, but can't get the team this season in a championship he's been our best player left wing. He's steps up another level and he's been, I would say, our best player this year, which is, you know, think never played consistently the championship in his career as he I think west who will and would be a good example. If you play West Whoo Lahn in league to, he's going to look all right. It's going to flickering it out the game, but the players are not on the same wave lengths of care. She's played in lead to. But we surrounded him with really good players and he was fantastic. The higher these players play on a better surface, at a better...

...environment, the bigger crowd, the more intensity players and any the play with quality around him, then he just played by I I finished my career at that, shrew's being league one. Really struggled because I dropped from a level where I expect to the players and a certain things and and sometimes it's a lot easy to play a higher level, and I think Kesh's one of them. Makes a lot of sense. I would have said you're in that category as well. Yeah, better pitches, you know, more to not a same more time on the ball, but, like say, just that quality on the ball. So you definitely in that category. I was going to ask you about interviews to black pules. have covered that really there. And then just touching on your left swindon and Sol food was a job you do as well. I've watched the documentary recently. How did you think he came across on that? Well, how did you have if you watched it black and I would have you find in it? Well, the reason again. So we actually won the league at Swindon. We got promoted and then Lee power, who's a previous chairman, had a court case and get over his head. So He's pretty evident that he was going to lose the club. So he was not willing to put any more money in because you know he's never going to get the money back. So that was a big problem. So soulford came in. It looks a good project that I spoke with Gary Neville on the interview process and obviously the way that played at Swindon is what it what it. That's the way that played our what I replicated, but the players that the added salted wasn't wasn't made to play that way. So it's no problem. We need to get promotion as quick as possible. We give you two A free transfer windows to get your own players in and get your own style across orkano problem. Bought into it. You end up going so I don't okay, one more games and a loss. We want a game at Wembler. We was always one result from getting the top two or three. We can see that. A few late goals. How did it come across on on the the documentary? Gary Neville edited. So he edited to a doctor documentary. If you give me all the footage of it than I can edit the way that I want ready. So you're not going to get Gary Evil, who's your sack, to manager and he's going on sky saying manager should be given time, should be given they should be given that. And then he's going to sap me a week after won a trophy at Wembler and then he's going to end it all happy dory and it's brilliant's Billen, brilliant. So I get it. It's a little bit political. Didn't need them, didn't need to be done and I'm not like that. It doesn't bother me. Once I've left the football club, I shake Handa wish him all the best and I'll move on. I know my ability as a coach. I'll back myself against against anybody. When you go into clubs. Now it depends on what mess and what financial situation in soul food was a fantastic, fantastic budget. My budget was zero. Hadn't spend a penny. So the previous manager that had finished mid table or finished for twelve, I think that I think is about twelve, had been given three and a half million in lead to to finish twelve and I was given nothing with somebody else's...

...players to have him. I think it was eight four night when I left three points off the playoffs with a game in and and just one at Wembler. Well, yeah, and you look at you know, get look by POL funds, look like go away for the job he did there and he's he's a good manager but he's not very going quiet, as he said. It does show that it's not as easy as it may look. And you know, some people might say I you should have won the title with that squad. Well, the previous manager didn't do it in the manager after is not done it either. So yeah, that I wouldn't say that I take more. You want to recruit to your style. That's the biggest thing. Because how I do think that Garry boys a decent appointment for the players that they've got, because you know, he's quite similar Glam hasander done really, I honestly believe great mark and would stayed, he would have he would have got promoted because because he recruited all of them players. Yeah, I think going able to say that because he does. He just say that. You know, probably pull the trigger too early on and a couple of managers doesn't need so, but I put up. But I also will say that if I would stayed that season I would have gotten the playoffs. And I also believe that I've always given a couple of transfer windows just to do a little bit of moving. I mean that the January transfer window that I had only had one window a white Elliet embleton, who the club said no, we can't have him. He went to black pollow and promotion. He would have played in league. To will keen was another one. So the three or four players that I wanted that we just we just did we just didn't get HMM. And then looking at what's next, then he said at the start you're waiting for the right opportunity and you want to make sure it's a club that's run well. Anything else in terms of what you're looking for. How quickly want to get back in or you know, how are you feeling about the future now? I mean, I'm a team and enjoying being a dad. Honestly, I've got three kids. One's one's playing for my uniting the twenty frees. So I can't see watch his games. Usually kicks off about this have a Friday night when away somewhere, or on a Saturday at about twelve one o'clock kickoff. I can't see go to his games now and give him to support that he needs. My over lads at United Academies under fourteen so I can take him train and drop him off. You know, my little girls into into all sorts of I can't see pick her up from school. I mean, I know this sounds like normal things, but when you're a manager and when you have to leave the outside past six to get to the club to prepare, to make sure everything's right, I ain't getting back till half five. Sometimes I might getting our five, have a quick tea and then I'm out to watch a game and I'm not getting back to art an eleven and the kids mission. And you don't and you don't realize that sometimes even if you signed a house of them, the there. So you're there, but you know you had to thinking about other things and you just use there in body, but actually the social aspect and the social connection with them you don't really have. So I'm enjoying that. I'm enjoying being add at the moment and I'm quite happy to even if it's not to our next net net the summer coming up. Then I'm quite happy to be out of...

...work and and and get out to different clubs and just studer and try and get better, because I've been for a lot. I've only been a manager for four years and the one thing I will say about souldodd one thing I didn't handle well was was working for someone like Gary Neville. You've got obviously the class in five world class superstar footballers, and I can be quite pressurized environment to be working because you know that every decision that you make is scrutinized. You know, Roy keying was over other side watching every single game and I probably didn't handle as well as what I could have work. Could have could have done that. I probably wish I would have had a couple more years experience before I took a job we've owners of that stature. So I made mistakes, no doubt about that. But, like I said, four years on, you know, I've want to lead title love on a League at when a trophy at Wembley. I can't complain. I'm only at the very, very start of my journeys a manager. You're going to you're going to well, you look at every single manager, they're going to have real big highs and real big lows at what I want to do is I want to try and find a club that that suits me and obviously that I suit them. Yeah, thanks a lot of sense. Wish you all of us in the search for it as well. Thanks often coming on chat until it's great to your perspective because you've been the Pantomi and villain for twenty years since you left. So it's great to a your perspective and great they have such fun memories of the Club as well. So we'll we're looking out for you. Know you getting in the future management wires and outfull. See you are bloom for the road again. Yeah, I know you're back in the box on your for the special guests for upcoming game. Is A bittial sound and if anybody throws any food up your gives me any abuse, I'm going to bring the box and words with me. Yeah, that's one. Well, yeah, she's coming on and doing the game tonight. All the best, like say, a future enjoy time your family while you're out. That's what I'm more involved with. Fan Reaction, Paul News and further competitions. Make sure that you sign up to our Bob Page and also for social media pages on twitter and facebook.

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